All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident

morten_s

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Today at 01:13:10 PM
Reply with quote  #340

Uro is the first cryptocurrency to utilize the blockchain as future contracts (EDIT: for legal reasons we will not use this term, but you can hold Uro as a way of claiming Urea some arbitrary time into the future – its more flexible than a traditional futures contract – as there are no set time limits) for a commodity. Innovative indeed. This will bring on the next era in the cryptoworld. Just the kind of potential utilization of cryptography (now the blockchain) Nick Szabo was talking about back in 1995 in this letter (http://cypherpunks.venona.com/date/1995/09/msg01303.html), and Andreas Antonopoulous continually speaks about in interviews. As the blockchain is not a currency per se, but a network of consensus and trust that effectually replaces a previously required law enforcing and contract binding entity (the court). As one form of blockchain utilization, future contracts can potentially fit perfectly. Decentralized and well away from any manipulative/corruptive influences. Cleverly simple. A truly brilliant and innovative initiative, especially when applying it to a market with prevailing volatilities in the extremes.

Like any new groundbreaking idea, it will be heavily antagonized in its infancy. That is the inescapable causatum. But, to quote Arthur Schopenhauer, German philosopher (1788 – 1860):

“All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.”

The world (John Q. Public, not just the cryptoworld) will take notice of these developments. Uro will not be the last initiative to utilize the blockchain in this manner, but it is the first.

I am bullish on agriculture, I am bullish on the value of the blockchain, and I am bullish on Uro, a marvelous coupling.

Morten

PS: Please read this insightful paper, if you haven’t already. Obligatory.

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2425270

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Showing Marketing Leadership by Applying Blockchain Technology

reader31

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Today at 11:54:26 AM
Reply with quote  #336

Can someone please explain how they ever plan on turning a profit?
Let’s pretend that the deal is real and someone just bought 12500 metric tons for about $60 000. That puts them down about $3 000 000.
Until the price of URO/UREA reaches the same price as FIAT/UREA they will be losing money, and if it does reach the same price they still would not be making any money because they are selling UREA.
So do they only plan on making money day trading (which sounds extremely sketchy)? And even if they are, if the price of URO/UREA were to reach the price of FIAT/UREA there would be no reason for people to still hold the coin, which means they will have to buy back any coins that people sell or else they will be still be selling UREA at a loss.
Am I missing something?

Here’s why it makes sense for GES to support URO.

-potential to increase their customer base
-being seen as a ground breaking company and the marketing/value that comes with it.(they are the world’s first company to do this)

In return for these potential benefits, they will take on the risk of selling Urea for uro at an initial loss.

Provided they are confident about the strategies and infrastructures that they have put in place to support uro, this risk can be negligible(even though the market might not know it yet).

As uro gains prominence the price will move closer to parity with urea price. Provided the company doesn’t have immediate need for cashing out uro. They might be willing to wait years for this to happen.

Also note that they are not putting their entire urea trading operation on uro, but only a small portion of it. So the lost they make on this initially can be offset.

Another interesting thing to note is that the price of uro will not always be trading equal to or less than price of urea. It will be moving up and down, especially when bitcoin experiences significant crash, Uro price will start to trade above the price of urea as uro will temporarily take on the role of safe asset within the cryptoecosystem. For a long term player these would provide ideal opportunities to cash out.

Look up the term ‘Loss Leader’

Capacity Advantages of Running Urocoin on a Separate Blockchain to Bitcoin

true-asset

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Uro: Backed by Millions of Tons of Urea Fertilizer

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Today at 10:56:43 AM
Reply with quote Edit message Delete message #244

but can someone please explain to me these other alt coins, why are they a good form a money… please explain anyone? I can see why Uro would be a good form of money it is backed by a real commodity and perhaps I can see why people would rather a anoncoin and a faster form of  money travel.. but btc is plenty fast and anon for me. 

A single blockchain can’t handle the global volume of transactions. That’s why in the end there will be a bunch of cryptos for commodities, industries, countries, various purposes. I’m not talking about a bunch of altcoins we have now but about the new ones that will be made by people who play the real game.

The observation that the Bitcoin blockchain may have issues handling transaction volume in the future as popularity increases is very valid. The size of each block has a configurable limit that may not be increasable to the desired amount to handle the real world load of all the side chains and protocols that are now being built on top of the Bitcoin blockchain.

It is known that the current Bitcoin Core release handles 7 tx/s, where as Visa processes 2000 tx/s. From this perspective, there are advantages to Uro being on a separate blockchain to Bitcoin. Uro’s 3 minute block time also allows the Uro blockchain to implicitly handle 200% more transaction volume than the Bitcoin blockchain with its 10 minute block time.

 
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How to Prosper From a Real Long Term Currency

true-asset

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July 10, 2014, 07:27:07 PM
Reply with quote Edit message Delete message #2474
Q: explain to me, how can he have bought 12500 tons for 12500 Urocoin valued at $3.75million when the current value of the coins are $220k

Actually the value of Uro is floating like any other currency and also like the value of Urea itself. Today its is $20, but next week its more likely to be $200 – much closer to the current value of Urea.

A commodity trading company takes at least 5 years to establish and usually does not profit until years after that. the commodities industry is composed or rational, calm and determined leaders who plan projects 5, 10 and even 15 years ahead and have the funding to fuel this determination, as demonstrated by the single transaction $25 Million USD BCL posted some days ago.

In today’s deal for example: GES now hold 12,500 Uro that are unlikely to be worth any less than 120% or the 2014 value of 12,500 metric tonnes of Urea in 5 years time (adjusting only for ~4% effective inflation – real inflation is higher – as can be measured by aggregated real estate and gold price increase per annum).

Therefore, Uro represents a pioneering investment for GES into the firm’s future prosperity, and elevates GES’s reputation to a new level of unprecedented technological and idealogical leadership in both the finance and commodities sectors worldwide, likely multiplying yearly revenue significantly due to increased in sales from both new and existing clients.

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The Pains of Convincing the Cryptocurrency Community that Big Business Still Exists Outside the Web in 2014

solid12345

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Today at 01:37:31 PM
Reply with quote  #2220

Just to add to the conversation, alot of FUD has been thrown around about the look of GES or Urea Trading India’s website, well to show just how silly this is, look up some Urea suppliers on Ali Baba

http://india.alibaba.com/country/suppliers_india-urea-trading.html

The number of Urea distributors on this list is just massive, and this is just in India! Now tell me how many of these companies on this list you think even have a website and if they do, how modern and slick do you think they are? 

Also if you type in Urea on Linkedin, you will find tons of people swapping email addresses looking for someone to buy Urea off of. Now you tell me URO wouldn’t be useful in these person-to-person deals where people trust one another to do business by email? 

I think so many people here are clueless how the non-Western world operates, people in developing countries, they don’t give a damn if you don’t have a Pinterest page, or a twitter site, or 100k friends on a Facebook page, or whatever other frivolous things that 1st worlders love that btctalk teenagers think one needs to prove you are a real company. Most of these companies do their daily business by telephone correspondence, their customers are usually loyal and do repeat business every growing season, trying to say a company is not real because they have no website or it is poorly constructed is pure BS.

In the world of commodity trading, GES is probably on a 1st tier level just to even have a web presence period. I think they are very forward thinking to recognize the future of crypto technology, just like African nations are embracing the mobile money and commerce future before the West, they have the luxury of using the latest technology to solve problems that the West is stuck behind due to decades of infrastructure that is difficult to replace overnight.

It will be corporations or other providers of utility who are most likely to introduce a currency that would be used by the vast majority of people

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June 20, 2014, 03:04:02 AM
Reply with quote  #832

The reason URO is probably better than bitcoin is you can’t hide the location of a fertilizer plant or storage warehouse like you can obfuscate the owner of a bitcoin wallet, so there’s an incentive to play fair, at least until the feedstock for your fertilizer plant runs out. (seehttp://petrodollar.org/ ) The problem here is that in the US, a couple of big fertilizer plants are owned by the Koch brothers, and they are experts at manipulating markets and buying public opinion, and also obfuscate how much oil and natural gas is actually economically recoverable.

Long story short, URO will be better than Bitcoin until the gas runs out. Then it collapses to zero overnight.

Meanwhile, I can always plant more http://blockscan.com/assetInfo.aspx?q=SOYBEANS and sell vegan soybean meal nitrogen fertilizer.

okay Harry Reid  Roll Eyes

Okay invoking the Koch brothers was a stupid argument. I have to have at least 3 stupid ideas before anything makes sense. But don’t you think that URO/Petrodollars/SOYBEANS would be a very interesting set of trading pairs on a distributed exchange?

Yes it would be very interesting. I just have very serious doubts this URO is legit. Somebody should try cashing in a Uro for a ton of Urea..I don’t think you’re going to get a ton of Urea for 50 cents. I’d love to be wrong, but my money says this is another pump and dump scam and I’m staying away.

I will call this bluff. Who’s willing to sell me 12,500 Uro for SOYBEANS? I will have physical soybeans for delivery in a few months, and for 50 cents a ton, I can find some farmers to charter a ship, or just cut some existing fertilizer company in for half the load.

12,500 Uro isn’t 50 cents a ton  Huh Sell me one ton of Soybeans for one Uro, or one ton of Urea for one Uro

I need 12,500 Uro per the contract specifications to trade it for a shipload of Urea. If Uro is $0.50 each, that is in theory 50 cents/ton of Urea. But only if there’s really a backer, so I’m taking a big risk cause it’s going cost at least $50,000 USD in legal fees, insurance and whatever else to charter a ship to call that bluff.

However, if you can deliver 20 tons (20,000kg) of Urea in a dry-bulk-bags to the Manly Terminal in a shipping container, I’ll send the container back with 10 tons of soybeans (10,000kg), based on the roughly 2 to 1 price ratio of Urea to soybeans

Do you have any idea how much press and attention we’d get in the worldwide commodities market if we actually executed this transaction instead of bullshitting about it on cryptocointalk? Go issue ‘UREA’ on counterparty with contract deliverable specifications for 1 ton of Urea in bulk bags (or 20tons in a container), and back it with URO, and then we can start trading fertilizer instead of BS. If you’ve got any ideas how to handle basis I’d love to hear them.

That is exactly the kind of stunt this needs. True-asset will need to pull off some expensive marketing strategies to make this happen. As soon as someone who lives near one of the NIER members calls his bluff it will be a very very expensive ordeal for the URO foundation if the price continues to stagnate. 

There is an interesting article on Coindesk today. http://www.coindesk.com/british-mp-bitcoin-may-zx-spectrum-digital-currencies/

“It will be corporations or other providers of utility who are most likely to introduce a currency that would be used by the vast majority of people, he indicated. This would be driven in part by digital currencies like bitcoin, but also because of high inflation rates and a “doomed” post-Bretton Woods system.

“The intriguing question that will determine the shape of the world is ensuring that every country has access to a multiplicity of reserves […] whether it’s bitcoin, O2 credit, Tesco credit. I suspect [the dominant currency of the future] will be backed by a large company that provides something of utility. A mobile phone company, or a supermarket chain,” he said.”

 

Uro can be used by farmers without understanding how cryptocurrency works

true-asset

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Today at 01:28:21 AM
Reply with quote Edit messageDelete message  #746

well its a big task to achieve, especially educating the not so literate farmers in India- M sure their children can better understand it. 

Would be great if those farmers could mine the URO Smiley

It all sounds very complicated, I hope the devs know what they are doing and how they can achieve it.

So once a farmer buys Urea with his URO from a retailer or wholesaler- then those pay URO to buy it from manufacturers. 

Now in Fiat world- farmer pays amount x to retailer- retailer pays x-y(his profits) to wholesaler- wholesaler pays x-y-z(his profits to the manufacturers. And thats how they all make money and run their businesses. 

So how does it work with URO- 1 URO = 1 MT urea. How would the process work, where would they make their profits. and what happens to all the URO which end up with the manufacturers- they sell it back to farmers or exchanges ( sounds complicated)

May be my thought process is totally wrong. But the concept is intersting and I am doing my part to the URO revolution by buying up as much as i can.

And when it all starts- i would happily donate some URO to some needy farmers in India Smiley

Cheers

The key to understanding Uro in the context of agriculture is that Uro IS Urea, just “delivered in the future” (Uro coins are divisible Urea futures contracts without tedious paperwork – with the blockchain being the means to eliminate this paperwork).

Now let Uro == “Urea delivered in the future” == “Urea Certificates (UC)” (simplified adaptation of Uro paper wallets for farmers/people who don’t want or need to know about futures or Uro as a cryptocurrency).

UCs provide farmers confidence in the sustainability of their operations by hedging away the risk that they may not be able to afford fertilizer next season if the fertilizer prices go up too much – In the longer term – farmers will learn to buy their UCs when the price is low (they cannot do this without Uro because Urea has a short shelf life and the lack of storage space) – this behaviour will force the price higher – hence forming a free market supply/demand stabilisation of Urea prices – which in term reduces the magnitude of fluctuations in the Urea price for the entire economy – even those not adopting Uro.

Wholesalers make their margin by simply selling UCs at a price higher then they paid for Uro. This is no different to before – when they brought the Urea at a lower distributors price and sold it at a higher wholesale price.

In the case where the farmer goes on an exchange and buys Uro themselves directly on the open currency exchanges (unlikely due to various difficulties – learning curve, internet, access to computers, electronic bank account access, etc) – they will have effectively saved the above margin that would have been earned by the wholesaler. But since very few farmers will end up doing this the loss in revenue to wholesalers will be minimal.

Finally wholesalers have access to Urea at lower prices when they sign yearly supply contracts with international trading companies (very common) – and this can still be achieved with Uro just as before. Uro and Urea can be both be supplied in larger quantities below the current market price to wholesalers – and they continue making their margins for providing a valuable service – inventory, accounting and customer support.

 
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Paper wallets eliminate learning curve & counterfeits for farmers adopting Uro for Urea supply management

true-asset

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Today at 04:41:43 PM
Reply with quote Edit message Delete message  #683

Just a thought would it not benefit the farmers to have the ability to purchase a prepaid URO card, to use as A. Currency B. acting hedge trader. This negates the necessity for a computer, and direct transfer from individuals in any local could take place without a middle man. Effectivly rendering any farmer a potential trader in URO. Granted they can hold on to the urea, or URO card directly. These cards could also be in smaller URO denominations. They would be sold and handled like phone minute cards, I’ve been to many rural places in 3rd world countries, phone cards are as prolific as soda these days.

If the local distributor had the ability to accept say .5 of a URO and the farmer still had .5 left on his card, he could chose to hold or sell at will. Price fluctuations will always be inherent in commodities due to supply and demand.

Paper wallets and brain wallets are definitely part of the plan involving the wholesalers for the next stage. We have not thought about cards but thanks for contributing this. Wholesalers will be trained to use Uro electronically while less frequent users can make do with paper wallets. If the Foundation donates Urea it would be in the form of Uro paper wallets, and Uro will be purchasable from Urea wholesalers.

For many farmers – understanding markets trends, cryptocurrency, finance, etc is a big problem indeed. However, if we just introduce a paper wallet which they can buy and hold as a certificate for Urea – then that is something everyone will understand. The best thing is that these certificates can be verified against counterfeiting due to the inherent power of the cryptocurrency network. 

“The best thing is that these certificates can be verified against counterfeiting due to the inherent power of the cryptocurrency network. ” Absolutely, the blockchain is such an elegant solution. At some point they will need to be scanned electronically though correct? An extra layer of i.d verification would lock it all in.

Yes the paper wallets would have a verify QR code, signature and address, which trained wholesalers would check with up coming software we are developing. At this point, ID verification does not appear necessary and would add curb adoption just as it has done for Bitcoin (to buy BTC with fiat at the moment you usually have submit documents and wait days for them to be approved by the exchange, and many choose to just forgo the experiment because of this hassle).

 
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The Uro Protocol is in force on 09 July 2014, not “some time in the next 10 years”

true-asset

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Today at 03:35:03 PM
Reply with quote Edit message Delete message  #678

So if I buy 12,500 Uro today on July 9th can I email the NIER with an order for 12,500 Tonnes Urea and they will accept, or are they only obligated to do so at some point in the next 10 years?  And who can sue the NIER if they don’t honor the contract, The URO Foundation i.e. themselves?

The ratifying companies are obliged to supply Urea for Uro starting from 09 July 2014. If they do not, the purchaser can take legal action against the company – since they are breaking the terms of a legally binding agreement.

The Protocol states that the companies must allow payment of Uro for Urea purchases for at least 10 years. A few people have tried to interpret the 12,500 metric tonne minimum order requirement (which is for the purpose of making sure the vessel is full) to be some sort of maximum order limit – but there is no mention of such a limit in the Protocol and such interpretations are incorrect.

 
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Uro improves on inefficient Urea subsidies that get absorbed by the middlemen

BitcoinBaBa

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Today at 08:30:53 PM
Reply with quote  #644

How does URO fit in with the government subsidization of urea in India?:”Urea is imported by three STEs (state trading enterprises) – Indian Potash Ltd (IPL), MMTC and STC on behalf of the government to meet domestic shortfall. The country produces about 22 MT against an annual domestic demand of 33 MT.”

“Urea is provided to farmers at a fixed subsidized maximum retail price (MRP) of Rs 5,360 per tonne. The difference between the cost of production and MRP of urea is provided as subsidy.”

5,360.00 INR   =   90.4319 USD

Are there farmers in Rajasthan buying subsidized Urea for 3 times the price?

A typical small to medium farmer without the right connections cannot access Urea at this subsidised price. To receive this subsidy they must go through a lot of bureaucracy and significant corruption occurs at this level. Although it is displayed at this price almost no one can actually make a real purchase of Urea for 5360 INR – most pay more then 3 times this amount.

In other words, this subsidy/discount gets absorbed by the middle elements of the supply chain – such as the agents.

This kind of fake “subsidy” is “available” in many developing nations.

I have to agree with this . Such issues are discussed in Indian news channels regularly.The rampant corruption in the system is one of the main causes of many farmers committing suicide. If farmers start using URO  they are entitled to equivalent metric tonne of Urea and need not worry about the prices and the manipulation in the system. This could be revolutionary if implemented correctly. 

Also http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/business/india-business/Government-plans-urea-price-hike-to-curb-fertilizer-subsidies/articleshow/36294375.cms   

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2011/20110822/main2.htm